Huge turnout Friday, I was pretty stoked to see that many people. It's getting a bit stale that the ride keeps going to the Seattle Center. In San Fran they usually take a vote before the ride to see where people want to ride to. I think that's a good idea, seeing as leaving it up to the few at the front tends to lead us to the exact same spot. For the record, that was the third time in 4 months that mass has ended up at the "Ghetto Velo."
Wouldn't it be nice to take the group to new places that need to see a huge contingent of bikes? Anywhere but freaking Pioneer Square or the Seattle Center would be a nice change.
Anyways, just my $.02. I'm curious what others think.
Happy Stick Person
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:42 am
Joined: 20 Sep 2006Posts: 1168Location: Leschi
yeah I was a little bummed that we didn't really ride anywhere, as was my girl. when we started heading north she got all excited that we were gonna take 99. when we rolled into seattle center and stopped she was like "is this it?"
Hayduke
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:43 am
Joined: 01 Feb 2006Posts: 677Location: Seattle, WA
I believe that the people up front take it Seattle Center because that is a convenient place to end the ride and get on with doing something else for the evening. When it used to go all the way to Green Lake there always seemed to be lost souls that weren't really sure what to do next and didn't know how to get back to their cars. As much as we would like to we can't take them all to the bar with us.
Happy Stick Person
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 11:50 am
Joined: 20 Sep 2006Posts: 1168Location: Leschi
Hayduke wrote:
As much as we would like to we can't take them all to the bar with us.
why not?
davis
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 12:03 pm
Joined: 26 Aug 2005Posts: 113Location: The northern waste
Seattle Center definitely made for a weak end to the ride (though some of us kept riding after that stop).
We should do another trip across the Aurora Bridge. That's always loads of fun.
TrikerTrev
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:21 pm
Joined: 23 Oct 2006Posts: 2303Location: FOCO, MOFO!!!
davis wrote:
Seattle Center definitely made for a weak end to the ride (though some of us kept riding after that stop).
We should do another trip across the Aurora Bridge. That's always loads of fun.
I love the ride over the "jumpers bridge"... nothing like having a 1/2 mile of straight downhill all to yourself...mmmm, speed! Going to the Gettodrome aint all that bas as long as the group progresses someplace else FROM there. It's is a good central location and gets noticed, but I completly that it is only a loop, not a endpoint.
Thing is, how do we get some traction on this and not make it look like like its being taken over by pointhomodateythree? Granted it seems like we are more vocal and organized, but we are obviously not the only riders there. Any ideas on how we can round up some ideas PRIOR to the ride? Maybe a fwe spokes people to verbally get some idea input while waiting at WLC? Since getting back into CM its only gone north...never east or south. Maybe somebody needs to reach out to the CM site Admin and post the question/issue there for more feedback.
derrickito
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:25 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
DamnageD wrote:
Maybe somebody needs to reach out to the CM site Admin and post the question/issue there for more feedback.
hi there.
i used to update the CM site but havent been the one doing it for a good year or more
it's mass, it's a mob. it has a mob mentality. if you want to lead it somewhere, pass the word around the best you can, and then get people up in the front leading it that way. you can post on the CM message board, or send and email to the CM mailing list too.
leading critical mass somewhere means getting up in the front, telling people where to go. thats all you have to do. be loud.
TrikerTrev
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:32 pm
Joined: 23 Oct 2006Posts: 2303Location: FOCO, MOFO!!!
derrickito wrote:
DamnageD wrote:
Maybe somebody needs to reach out to the CM site Admin and post the question/issue there for more feedback.
hi there.
i used to update the CM site but havent been the one doing it for a good year or more
it's mass, it's a mob. it has a mob mentality. if you want to lead it somewhere, pass the word around the best you can, and then get people up in the front leading it that way. you can post on the CM message board, or send and email to the CM mailing list too.
leading critical mass somewhere means getting up in the front, telling people where to go. thats all you have to do. be loud.
Check off; "contact CM site Admin"
mcrawfor
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:33 pm
Joined: 09 May 2006Posts: 1039Location: Ballard
derrickito wrote:
leading critical mass somewhere means getting up in the front, telling people where to go. thats all you have to do. be loud.
An airhorn helps too.
_________________ -miles
derrickito
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:37 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
it's about time i hooked the air compressor back up to my bike.
joeball
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:41 pm
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
Bikes accumulate and come to a standstill at Seattle Center like cars on a freeway at 5:00pm. I see the statement "Critical Mass is leaderless" as a paradox. When there are no leaders mass kind of fizzles, people end up going places it has been often or recently or towards home. Maybe a frisky newbie leads the pack up one of the ridiculously steep block downtown, maybe the old, confrontational dude with glasses and pony tail tries to take mass on 99 or I-5 every time, maybe the cops hassled people on Cap Hill last time so it goes back there but to get very far people end up leading.
.83 may not be a majority of the massers by attendance we are by frequency. If you ride with .83 but try to steer CM it might feel or look like .83 is leading mass but that is what it takes to get a bunch of people somewhere, leaders. Lots of people who are in .83 now originally met through mass and helped 'lead' it about 2 years ago. Possible destinations might be discussed and a few people were all that was needed to sort of steer the ride, this has tapered off now, no one else has really stepped up.
I'd call .83 an off shoot from CM, it took the some dedicated people who attended and spoke out for mass and made a more intentional group riders who were not afraid to have a destination
Hayduke
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:52 pm
Joined: 01 Feb 2006Posts: 677Location: Seattle, WA
Andre,
What I hear you saying is that .83 is like the Officers of CM. We are the leadership of the movement on the ground. Leadership means responsibility which means we need make sure that our group is not attracting negative attention through "inappropriate" actions because we will become responsible for each others actions. We may even want to select some representatives to attend Training Wheels Meetings, Bike Master Plan Meetings, and interact directly with the local authorities. If we get the approval of our route from the local authorities before hand we could greatly reduce the confrontation factor. But I ask you; if we do all these things, is it still Critical Mass?
langston
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 1:58 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
Hayduke wrote:
But I ask you; if we do all these things, is it still Critical Mass?
No.
Happy Stick Person
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:18 pm
Joined: 20 Sep 2006Posts: 1168Location: Leschi
langston wrote:
Hayduke wrote:
But I ask you; if we do all these things, is it still Critical Mass?
No.
Agreed, I say if you wanna take the mass somewhere get your ass up front and make some noise, but do it during the ride. people drop off the mass all throughout the ride. if people don't want to stick around and see where the hell it goes well then screw em. the only thing to keep in mind is this isn't a .83 ride, so keep the pace slow and try not to climb any 15% downgrades...
BTW I always though greenlake was the quazi official endpoint for CM
joeball
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:18 pm
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
No, I am saying a portion of .83 (derrick and Jryde mainly) plus some other U district folks had a period of particular influence 1.5-2 years ago. After .83 started it became the largest sub-group of CM that knew each other, so between this subset, destinations were suggested and led. I understand your thought a that "leadership means responsibility" but let me ask this "are all leaders responsible?" People attend mass for a variety of reason but many prefer to hover on the fringes, to maintain anonymity. But if some one like angry pony-tail dude starts yelling "this way" and no one else counters it and a few people follow, the next thing you know mass in on 99. The group has been led. I've never heard of anyone wanting to be the CM president or leader or contact point. But when you get down on the ground you will see that Mr (or Ms.) X has led Cm from A to B.
Like I said, I view .83 as an offshoot from CM, CM was there first. Many of us met or heard about .83 on CM. .83 grew and matured and became something different, it filled a particular niche of bike culture in Seattle, it brought together people who were not opposed to mass but didn't fit in with Cascade, Squid teams, or Dead Baby groups.
derrickito
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:27 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
there were a few of us that used to have monthly critical mass meetings, set up flyering parties, and all that jive. but in the end, it's just a big mob that goes where the loudest person leads.
if anyone has an idea for a good destination, just shout it out on here, and be vocal about it and get people to turn the mob that way, get a few helpers on here if you can and make it happen. just dont be upset if someone else takes the reins and is louder, sometimes you'll make it where you want to go, sometimes you wont.
i personally ended up having a better time just not caring where the ride went, and enjoying the ride for what it was, a big lumbering hulk of happy bicyclists. i just have a good time now hanging around, chatting with friends, and corking. where i end up isnt as important.
taking 99 is one of my personal favorites with CM. it's always a good time. kind of awe inspiring. people are just baffled and excited that when we take a major highway. makes me giggle with glee on the inside.
lantius
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:33 pm
1337Joined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 6705Location: right over
andre i'm a little concerned that your writing style is beginning to sound like aaron's. (eek!)
the u-district group was definitely making an effort to be responsible for cm, printing flyers and organizing, etc, etc. not really sure what happened to all those folks?
the issue with critical mass is the extreme shortness of memory. old people get burned out and leave, and new people step up and make the same mistakes, or assume that the way things happened on their first ride has some special historical significance. so that's how you end up going to seattle center four months in a row, or taking the 99 bridge (even though it is a stupid, horrible route when you get on 99 in downtown) every single month, or going to greenlake constantly.
one major issue with seattle is that the routes are largely shitty out of downtown, due to the layout of the city it's almost all major arterials with miles of nothing between the vibrant urban cores that critical mass's visibility in is ideal.
but that's just my opinion.
jeff
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:38 pm
SOC pussyJoined: 05 May 2006Posts: 4501
Whoever decided to try to lead the group up onto the viaduct to head south in the north-bound lanes should be awarded the "Natural Selection Award."
derrickito
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:41 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
i like to see how many times a year i can drive to critical mass, then try and beat that record
joeball
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 2:56 pm
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
lantius wrote:
a
the u-district group was definitely making an effort to be responsible for cm, printing flyers and organizing, etc, etc. not really sure what happened to all those folks?
the issue with critical mass is the extreme shortness of memory. old people get burned out and leave, and new people step up and make the same mistakes,
Sort of my point,. I've known of CM in Seattle for about 5 years and have probably been on it dating back about 3 years. I understand and have seen it take on slightly different forms over time. The U district crew was around for a while but that sort of tapered out. An other example would be messengers. My understanding of it is that they used to be involved in CM but after some cop confrontation incidents they kind of pulled out since they didn't see it as beneficial for their, this was before my time though so I can't speak to that from experience. People come and people go and mass will take on different characteristics based on that.
Maybe the confusion or conflicting understanding is for people who have ridden with .83 for a while and heard about Critical Mass through that rather than vice versa.
Not sure what makes my writing style Goss-like but I am gaining empathy as far as others not understanding what he is saying. Don't you get it people?!?!?, Coke and Aids!!!!!
Just face it Derrick, you like to sit in the shadows and watch people make asses out of themselves, it only takes a gentle nudge. *offers Wild Turkey* ;)
mike.hahn
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:23 pm
Joined: 20 Jan 2006Posts: 203
Critical Mass is irrelevant. See you next month!
Finn
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:45 pm
AlabamaJoined: 15 Sep 2006Posts: 303Location: Central District
mike.hahn wrote:
Critical Mass is irrelevant. See you next month!
Word, Mike.
Critical Mass has its virtues, and I fully support it. But in terms of putting cyclists on the streets, .83 rides, commuter clubs, ect. have way more impact. More hours on the road in small packs will do more to influence drivers than a monthly carnival on wheels in the downtown. It also goes further to encourage cyclists in their frequency and power as individuals to access roadways. Anything that puts a few riders out on the roads more than monthly is far more important than CM.
Side Thought: What if, instead of a predictable mass, we all just rode alone in an area for a designated period, functioning as hyper-concentrated bike traffic. Not plausable, but more direct.
langston
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 3:51 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
Finn wrote:
Side Thought: What if, instead of a predictable mass, we all just rode alone in an area for a designated period, functioning as blah blah hippie performance art crackpot idealistic nonesense
medical bills high? I hear you have pain killers...
Aaron
Posted: Mon Jan 29, 2007 5:54 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 4645
Andre, Goss-like? I think it is the West Sizzle influence.
Critical Mass is a party. It is Fun. I get so damn giddy the last Friday of the month. I can hardly stand how much fun and excitment it give me! Like all good parties, you don't want it end. It was a let down that it ended so soon at the Ghettodrome. It was like 45 minutes, and over. .83 usually ends up gathering at some pub before the race and that is always fun too. Because of the Greenlake race, I don't mind that CM often goes north.
I "led" one CM after there was talk of keeping it turning often and staying downtown longer. All you have to do it get in the front and turn. People usually follow. If they don't get in front again and turn again. It is easy. If there are 5 or 6 of us doing that in unison, then it is eaven easier. Taking Aroura is awesome! It might be fun to take the mass down by the stadium then up the on-ramp onto 99 and north on the lower level of the viaduct and thru the Battery Street tunnel. That would be CRAZY! We could exit right after the tunnel (or not) and head back into downtown.
Often, though, I enjoy just riding in the middle of the pack.
pete jr
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:05 am
Joined: 13 Dec 2005Posts: 1930Location: balls deepx
I'm just sad that the whole mass doesn't end up riding around the center of the thing. It's great seeing the fountain filled with blinkies.
MikeOD
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 11:47 am
Joined: 04 Feb 2006Posts: 545
I agree that it's fun seeing a lot of bikes with lights riding around in the fountain. But it doesn't make any sense to me to take mass to seattle center. It's a pedestrian area. I thought the whole point of critical mass was to be a presence on the roads, where cars drive. On the other hand, when .83 goes there it makes sense, because we'll stick a thumb in anyone's eye.
Razi
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:07 pm
Joined: 16 Dec 2005Posts: 866Location: Seattle
It does seem pretty silly to steer CM right in the middle of a large car-free plaza. But it is no less silly to promote bicycle awareness by steering right into the abandoned warehouse district in Sodo (does anyone else find it weird when CM goes there?)
Best CM ever was to Seward Park. Part of that might have been how nice the day was though (I think that was last July). Really, I think CM is the most fun when it is of decent duration, high visibility, and gleeful mischief. Riding on 99 is fun, but so is parading up Eastlake to the UD. So for that matter would be rolling up Leary to Market St. and taking over the locks, or going down Alaskan Way during tourist season and ending at Alki.
Some people (angry ponytail man) might like CM to be of maximal annoyance to cars, and hitting up 99 accomplishes this for sure. I actually prefer it when we go to places where cars do go, but where pedestrian culture is also great. The Ave, Broadway, 45th, Market St., and 2nd Avenue are all great places for this sort of presence. For me at least, one of the great pleasures of CM is seeing the joy on pedestrians faces as we roll past, and getting high-fives from random folks on the sidewalk.
Joined: 29 Jan 2007Posts: 117Location: Wallingford
Hey... long-time lurker, first-time poster.
I was there on Friday. It was only my second Mass (the first being last summer after that cyclist was killed in West Seattle). Here's a question: Why didn't we start riding until 6:15 or 6:20? I thought the idea of Critical Mass was to be visible during RUSH HOUR traffic. By 6:15 everyone's already outta the city and stuck on the freeway!
pete jr
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:46 pm
Joined: 13 Dec 2005Posts: 1930Location: balls deepx
i really don't give a shit where cm rides. it's an excuse to drink and ride bikes and yell at stuff.
Hayduke
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 12:55 pm
Joined: 01 Feb 2006Posts: 677Location: Seattle, WA
DOUG. wrote:
Hey... long-time lurker, first-time poster.
I was there on Friday. It was only my second Mass (the first being last summer after that cyclist was killed in West Seattle). Here's a question: Why didn't we start riding until 6:15 or 6:20? I thought the idea of Critical Mass was to be visible during RUSH HOUR traffic. By 6:15 everyone's already outta the city and stuck on the freeway!
Lurker, the berserker,
mostly because the happy hour at the Whiskey Bar has PBR+Whiskey for Three bucks and we were there until 1800. I agree in theory with you and would support you in your attempts to get the mob rolling at 1730. Good luck though, for some it is the social aspect of standing around WL Plaza that brings them out. We call them scenesters.
Happy Stick Person
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:05 pm
Joined: 20 Sep 2006Posts: 1168Location: Leschi
Hayduke wrote:
and we were there until 1800. I agree in theory with you and would support you in your attempts to get the mob rolling at 1730.
I fucking hate military time, and I hate you for making me count on my fingers to figure out what fucking time you were talking about.
and, I like to watch the scenesters doing fancy dismounts in their ladies stretch denim, especially when they fuck up and rack their balls.
DOUG.
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 1:12 pm
Joined: 29 Jan 2007Posts: 117Location: Wallingford
Yeah, that's sorta what I figured. I'm, like, 100 years old and think PBR tastes like piss, so therefore not a scenester. Perhaps I'll bring a nice bottle of Sangiovese to Westlake next month and watch the scenesters do tricks in ladies pants.
Hayduke
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:06 pm
Joined: 01 Feb 2006Posts: 677Location: Seattle, WA
Happy Stick Person wrote:
Hayduke wrote:
and we were there until 1800. I agree in theory with you and would support you in your attempts to get the mob rolling at 1730.
I fucking hate military time, and I hate you for making me count on my fingers to figure out what fucking time you were talking about.
and, I like to watch the scenesters doing fancy dismounts in their ladies stretch denim, especially when they fuck up and rack their balls.
You probably still use standard tools too and wonder why they don't fit all your bike parts. I myself prefer the accuracy of the 24 hour clock and metrics.
Aaron
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:08 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 4645
5:30 meet up, 6 PM depart is a good formula.
.83 could easily get mass rolling by 6. All we have to do is start hollerin' and spinning up.
This month's mass everyone just wanted to chat and stand around. Maybe because it was so cold? I don't know. Makes no sense to me. Riding keeps you warm.
.83 does not have to be leader-like at all, but we can be active and give mass a kick in the but.
Next month let's leave by 6 PM, turn often, keep it downtown for at least an hour, avoid going into the Center and hoot and holler more.
TrikerTrev
Posted: Tue Jan 30, 2007 2:37 pm
Joined: 23 Oct 2006Posts: 2303Location: FOCO, MOFO!!!
Aaron wrote:
5:30 meet up, 6 PM depart is a good formula.
.83 could easily get mass rolling by 6. All we have to do is start hollerin' and spinning up.
This month's mass everyone just wanted to chat and stand around. Maybe because it was so cold? I don't know. Makes no sense to me. Riding keeps you warm.
.83 does not have to be leader-like at all, but we can be active and give mass a kick in the but.
Next month let's leave by 6 PM, turn often, keep it downtown for at least an hour, avoid going into the Center and hoot and holler more.
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