now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
as we were getting langstons bike last night i inspected my rear wheel to find the source of the thump thump thumping that i was feeling as i applied brakes to the rim. my rear rim looks to be collapsing on itself. i could just change out the rim, but the wheels have quite a few miles on them and im thinking about just replacing outright and keeping the current wheels as spares
was also going to price out something from aarons shop (first person i thought of for these). ill be calling you after work tonight :)
thoughts on those two wheelsets above? should i avoid or are they decent?
im going to be taking these on a 3 week tour of NZ next month, and want to have something sturdy enough that i dont need to worry about. i also use this bike for long distance rides, and regular tomfoolery around town. just dont want them to buckle under touring weight.
the dreaded ben
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:31 am
Grumpy GreebJoined: 20 Aug 2005Posts: 5329Location: flavor country
hey american, build decent wheels so they don't need to be replaced every fucking season.
derrickito
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:36 am
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
you're as helpful as a brick :)
just checking to see if these are as bad as some overseas factory wheelset or if someone thinks they look solid enough to NOT be the type of wheels that id have to replace every season
ive dumped a pile of money into my bike and trip that im taking, and having to get new wheels right now is tapping me out. trying to see if these are worth it without breaking my bank
lantius
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:36 am
1337Joined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 6705Location: right over
i am really happy with my velocity dyad 36h laced to xt hubs. burly fuckers!
zuvembi
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:45 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 942Location: Little Addis Ababa
Alex makes excellent rims, 36 spokes is good. Is it shimano or shimano-compatible? The lower grade shimano hubs are still good, the no-name knockoffs can be not-so-good.
_________________ When the revolution comes, we're going to need a longer wall
joeball
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:48 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
Neither, of the sets you linked to. The chucks bike wheelset has decent components and could probably be untensioned then retensioned and be close to a handbuilt quality but this would still be on the light-duty end.. Just because the other wheelset has 36 spokes wouldn't make up for the other unknown variables in my mind.
Like you say you are off to NZ very soon and want to have something that you can trust for the duration of the trip and beyond. i would say have a wheelset built (atleast the rear). Go 36 spoke, a Shimano 105 hub(your Jake has 130mm rear spacing I believe). I have had good experiences with the Salsa Delgado Cross rim for 3 wheels I have built with them, they have a wide cross section and fit larger tires well. The Velocity Dyad is the other heavy duty rim than many seem happy with.
I know you are planning on going light, gear wise, but you really should just pony up for some wider tires. 28mm at a bare minimum.
A handbuilt set will probably be about double what you could get machine built set for. Stock, your bike came with wheels that are probably equivalent to the new machine built wheels you are looking at again and you see that they are close to needing replacement after 2 years. A good handbuilt set should last you more than 2 years but it will cost you up front, you need to make the call, or sell another corndog.
MikeOD
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 3:25 pm
Joined: 04 Feb 2006Posts: 545
What Andre said, can't improve on that advice.
What's the story with your NZ tour? Where are you going? I spent some time there some years ago. The country is beautiful and popular for bike touring, but a lot of the roads are narrow and twisty curvy, tricky with traffic, careful!
derrickito
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 3:29 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
yeah ill probably end up doing the local build. i have a set of 36 hole hubs that i havent laced up yet, ill pop those into aaron and get his advice
mike, im leaving feb 28th, doing a few days in sydney to see some friends, then flying into christchurch. planning on doing just the south island. im digging through my lonely planet now for landmarks and getting my route down. mostly going to wing it by the seat of my pants. ill be in NZ for 3 weeks. going solo (anyone wanna go?)
if you know of any places i should for sure check out, id love to hear it. ill probably try and circle the entire island, but im also planning on taking it easy and seeing as much as i can. if i feel like sitting on a sunny beach and reading a book for two days, ill probably do that too.
martin
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 3:49 pm
Joined: 30 Jan 2006Posts: 712
derrickito wrote:
mike, im leaving feb 28th, doing a few days in sydney to see some friends, then flying into christchurch.
I leave the day after you for Sydney and I'm bringing my bike (if it shows up in time). I'll post to this thread if I can find my head from my ass after 16 hours on a plane with a 6mo. We should meet up to ride centenial park or whatever they call it.
henry
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 3:56 pm
somewhat piggishJoined: 05 Aug 2005Posts: 5415Location: on porch with shotgun
I know some girls down there. All about 21 years old. They've got myspace profiles too. Hahaha. It's true though, exchange students when I was in high school.
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
martin wrote:
derrickito wrote:
mike, im leaving feb 28th, doing a few days in sydney to see some friends, then flying into christchurch.
I leave the day after you for Sydney and I'm bringing my bike (if it shows up in time). I'll post to this thread if I can find my head from my ass after 16 hours on a plane with a 6mo. We should meet up to ride centenial park or whatever they call it.
yeah that sounds cool. ill be staying at a friends house for a few days, will have the days to kill alot of time and see the city. ill have my bike with me there too.
ill get you some contact info where ill be staying closer to my leave date.
or you could always start a thread here, i should have net access in sydney.
point 83 rides OZ
derrickito
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:06 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
henry wrote:
I know some girls down there. All about 21 years old. They've got myspace profiles too. Hahaha. It's true though, exchange students when I was in high school.
hook it up!
langston
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:51 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
joeball wrote:
Go 36 spoke, a Shimano 105 hub(your Jake has 130mm rear spacing I believe). I have had good experiences with the Salsa Delgado Cross rim for 3 wheels I have built with them, they have a wide cross section and fit larger tires well.
I just picked up this rim, in a 22.mm size for $40 at REI while I was there returning gloves. Get there today if you want super-marked down winter gear.
I'll SYLBS by buying spokes, nipples and a new cassette (broke that too, damnit) from ABR if I can get there in time tonight.
henry
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:51 pm
somewhat piggishJoined: 05 Aug 2005Posts: 5415Location: on porch with shotgun
derrickito wrote:
henry wrote:
I know some girls down there. All about 21 years old. They've got myspace profiles too. Hahaha. It's true though, exchange students when I was in high school.
hook it up!
I figure this information might be worth something to you. I like Mr. Franklin, he electrifies me.
The wheel builder is much more important than the components used. Well built wheels that use inexpensive components (such as Sun CR18 rims and Alivio hubs) will be much more durable than poorly built wheels that are using expensive parts.
Most mail order wheels are built to be as cheap as possible (because that gets them more profit). They know that the buyers shop for component labels, so they make them cheaper by using high quality components with a low quality build.
If you are comfortable building wheels then the mail order wheels can be a good way to get cheap parts. You can untension the spokes and retension them properly and get good wheels.
If you are a longterm cheapskate like myself you should just learn how to build your own wheels. It's easy to build wheels well, it is just harder to build them well and fast. You probably don't need to build them fast, just well. Get a copy of "The Bicycle Wheel", borrow a truing stand, and go for it. I'm still putting most of my miles on a rear wheel that I built 10 years ago and haven't touched since then. It's the third wheel that I ever built.
If you still don't want to build them yourself then get a trusted local mechanic to do it. I've never had wheels built by Aaron, but I'm sure they are great. Val, who sometimes works at his shop, has built a few very durable wheels for me (including the rear wheel on my old recumbent tandem that saw huge loads). Larry at Perfect Wheel on Roosevelt is also a very good local builder if you happen to live in North Seattle like I do.
alex
Aaron
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 6:05 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 4645
Lots of good advice here.
Velocity Dyad or Sun CR 18 are the rims of choice.
Components are important, but the builder is more so. That is why we use Phil Wood spokes and DT nipples and guarantee all of our wheels for life! I will true or replace broken spokes if you ever need it, but you won't!
MikeOD
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 7:34 pm
Joined: 04 Feb 2006Posts: 545
derrickito wrote:
mike, im leaving feb 28th, doing a few days in sydney to see some friends, then flying into christchurch. planning on doing just the south island. im digging through my lonely planet now for landmarks and getting my route down. mostly going to wing it by the seat of my pants. ill be in NZ for 3 weeks. going solo (anyone wanna go?)
You really can't go wrong, the south island is spectacular. Check out this guy's site for good cycling route suggestions: NZ suggested routes. His suggestion to combine the Lakes and Mountains route with the West Coast sounds good, that's probably what I would aim for.
I was there 13 years ago but we were driving/hiking, different travel timeframe from biking obviously. The west coast is more isolated and quiet than other areas on the south island, very beautiful, esp. the Haast pass area. Wanaka was a quiet, pretty little town where we rested up for a few days. Biking through the valleys near mt cook would be incredible. Queenstown area is a buzzing, belching adventure-tourist mecca in the midst of amazing scenery, probably has a good nightlife. Kaikoura is a little town north of Christchurch with a stunning coastline, where they use helicopters and speedboats to chase down sperm whales, so you can catch a glimpse of tail as the whales head for the bottom, saying fuck these morons I'm getting the hell out of here. I also think you can get ass-fucked by a dolphin there.
If you have time to take a side trip to Milford Sound by bus or something (don't know if you can bike there), and maybe take a boat ride once you get there, then go for it. Maybe you can catch a round trip from Queenstown or Te Anau. When I was there the drive to the sound was worth it in itself. The road was pretty rough but it's surrounded by sheer cliffs thousands of feet high with water cascading down the faces. The Arthur's Pass area is also said to be incredibly beautiful but we didn't cross the mtns there.
There's so much to see just on the south island it's easy to spread yourself too thin. My friends and I had I think 5 weeks by car and we didn't get to everywhere we wanted to go, although we were also doing multi-day hikes, and spent at least a week out of commission being sick. If your budget allows, you might want to consider using one of the train routes out of Christchurch to link up to the start of your ride, that would let you see a lot that you wouldn't see from the road. One of them crosses the alps through Arthur's Pass, and another goes up the east coast through Kaikoura to Picton. If you're lucky the conductor may sing a corny song for you.
I haven't looked at mileage, but if I had 3 weeks on a bike I'd probably take the trans-alps train to Greymouth and start down the west coast from there. Or if the mileage looked doable, take the train to Picton to start.
MikeOD
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:41 pm
Joined: 04 Feb 2006Posts: 545
I like the Dyad rims, I find it easier to mount tires on them than the CR18.
huckerjesse
Posted: Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:31 pm
Joined: 30 Jan 2007Posts: 51Location: Burien, WA.
im working on my 5th wheel build (dont have me build your wheels.. YET!) but i have learned soooo much from the person that showed me, he learned mostly from Val (that works @ aarons on the weekends) and components of the build are important, but the proper build by a VERY experinced builder is more important. If your hard on stuff it will break, but a well built wheel will last you longer than one i built... haha... just kidding but you get the point... :-)
~Jesse
Alex
Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 4:43 pm
Joined: 18 May 2006Posts: 3128Location: Roosevelt
MikeOD wrote:
You really can't go wrong, the south island is spectacular. Check out this guy's site for good cycling route suggestions: NZ suggested routes.
I just want a put a plug in for the north island. I spent a month on the north island and three weeks on the south island and really enjoyed both of them. The scenery is very different, think of the south island as WA and BC (big mountains, lots of waterfalls, lots of rain) and the north island as northern CA, southern OR. It's warmer, less rain, and the beaches are better. I'd love to go back sometime and ride around the Coromandel (north island) or do a loop from Auckland up to the Bay of Islands, up to the north tip, and back down.
Some friends are touring NZ right now and blogging about it at erck.org.
[quote[If you have time to take a side trip to Milford Sound by bus or something (don't know if you can bike there), and maybe take a boat ride once you get there, then go for it. [/quote]
You can bike there, but it is a long ride in each direction and the same route in each direction. I think most folks end up riding one way and taking the bus back.
We flew from Queenstown on a small plane. It was a little expensive but amazing. The planes can't climb over the mountains so you are flying through valleys and you look out the side window and see waterfalls falling from above you to below you. I don't remember what it cost, maybe $150-200US for the day, but it was one of the more memorable days in my life.
Quote:
There's so much to see just on the south island it's easy to spread yourself too thin. My friends and I had I think 5 weeks by car and we didn't get to everywhere we wanted to go, although we were also doing multi-day hikes, and spent at least a week out of commission being sick.
I think this is true. I've spend 7 weeks of my life in NZ (by car/hiking, not too much biking) and feel like I only touched the surface. It would be easy to spend 6-12 months there.
If you are planning on doing much cycling in the mountains make sure that you bring good gear for all types of weather. On my trip to the south island I did a sub-24hour tour over the Rainbow Road (a 4x4 track from St Arnaud to Hamner Springs). This was in November (early summer) and I woke up in the middle of the night to a pretty big snowstorm. I was borderline prepared for snow and almost got into pretty nasty trouble when my hands were getting frost-bitten.
It was still one of the best bike rides of my life.
alex
Alex
Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 4:48 pm
Joined: 18 May 2006Posts: 3128Location: Roosevelt
MikeOD wrote:
I like the Dyad rims, I find it easier to mount tires on them than the CR18.
The CR18 doesn't have a very deep drop in the spoke bed, and this can make it more difficult to mount tight tires (especially ones with folding beads). On the other hand they built very strong wheels, aren't terribly heavy, come in almost every size and drilling, and are cheap. I've probably built more wheels with CR18s than any other rim, perhaps more than with all other rims combined. These qualities apply to the wider Rhyno Lite too, except that it is a bit porky. Both use triple box section designs.
The Velocity Synergy is another very nice rim and would probably be my recommendation for a first time builder. The rear is off center so you don't need to worry so much about uneven spoke tension when dishing. The center of the rim is very deep so you can change many tires without tools. They build up strongly and are more true before tensioning than the CR18, so they are a little easier to work with. The downside is that they cost $50ish (vs $30ish for a CR18) and are harder to find. I've only used them in 584mm (650B). I think they are also made in 622m (700C), but I could be wrong and they are made in 559mm (26").
alex
Aaron
Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 7:03 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 4645
Even front wheels need to be "dished."
I am always amazed at how a front wheel is out of dish when I check it. You assume front wheels are perfectly symetrical and the spokes are pefect, but it is alway neccessary to check the dish. 50% of the time a slight adjustment is necessary. Usually about a 1/4 turn.
Torch
Posted: Sat Feb 10, 2007 10:49 pm
TerranceJoined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 1637Location: Amsterdam, The Netherlands
henry is the nurse on the left.
_________________ "the only difference between me and a madman is that i am not mad."
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derrickito
Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 10:29 am
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
new wheel built at aarons
velocity dyad laced to a shimano 105 hub. im all set.
Aaron
Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 6:53 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 4645
derrickito wrote:
new wheel built at aarons
velocity dyad laced to a shimano 105 hub. im all set.
I forgot to put my sticker on it for you. I will bring it on Thursday.
Denali
Posted: Mon Feb 12, 2007 8:39 pm
Joined: 28 Feb 2006Posts: 30Location: Eastlake
Those Alex wheels are good. I dont know about the spokes but I do know that some Langsters come with those exact wheels.
TrikerTrev
Posted: Tue Feb 13, 2007 7:15 pm
Joined: 23 Oct 2006Posts: 2303Location: FOCO, MOFO!!!
from collapsed rims to 21 yo foreign booty calls in 9 posts....classic!
derrickito
Posted: Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:25 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
martin wrote:
I leave the day after you for Sydney and I'm bringing my bike (if it shows up in time). I'll post to this thread if I can find my head from my ass after 16 hours on a plane with a 6mo. We should meet up to ride centenial park or whatever they call it.
i just got in martin, friday morning here.
monday might be a good day for me to go take a spin around with you. possibly sunday day. if you check this let me know.
im staying in the Newtown area south of downtown. by King Street. im putting my bike together right now for a spin. fucking monkeys are all on the wrong side of the street.
the flight isnt so bad. i had a 14.5 hour flight from SFO on qantas and it was great. on demand video and movies, and they fed me like a king. havent seen corndogs yet, ill keep you all posted on corndog sightings
derrickito
Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 1:57 am
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
strangest thing ever. im dorking around on my bike riding around the sydney opera house asking strangers to take pictures of me and i hear "hey, derrick, DERRICK!"
martin finds me.
small fucking world
Hayduke
Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 7:22 pm
Joined: 01 Feb 2006Posts: 677Location: Seattle, WA
These pics you speak of, where might they be posted? Have you started a BLOG for Derrick Eats Australia?
derrickito
Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 7:46 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
all still on my camera. ill post some up later when i get the chance.
martin
Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:59 pm
Joined: 30 Jan 2006Posts: 712
derrickito wrote:
all still on my camera. ill post some up later when i get the chance.
I left for Aus in a mad rush forgetting to check this thread. Totally dumb luck that Derrick was at the Opera House when we were rolling up with my Family. I never got much of a ride in while in Sydney - maybe on the way back. I did venture out for a ride the evening I saw him and almost bought it 3 times while checking the wrong way at an intersection. Damn left-hand-driving-countries!
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