This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
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langston
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:18 am
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
yes. Fear of hills is a noob thing
joeball
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:19 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
Mr. 75 Dollars wrote:
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
yes. Fear of hills is a noob thing
I thought bike lanes were a noob thing
Eric_s
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:21 am
Joined: 07 Mar 2007Posts: 1691Location: the dirty south
Mr. 75 Dollars wrote:
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
yes. Fear of hills is a noob thing
Or people might just use jackson street, it not being too far away, and a good path to use 12th to get up to seattle u.
Basically, if you're not a total meathead, there's plenty of ways to get up, over, or around that hill which don't require climbing yesler. n00b.
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zuvembi
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:22 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 942Location: Little Addis Ababa
Edit: ^^^ Damn it Eric!
Mr. 75 Dollars wrote:
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
yes. Fear of hills is a noob thing
Pffft. Or you could just realize there are much better routes than Yesler in general. You gain a lot of elevation, but unless you're going to the hospital, you lose it again. Jackson to the south, or just about any of the streets to the north are generally better.
snyd3282
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 9:41 am
could suck the fun out of a blowjobJoined: 23 Jul 2007Posts: 588Location: Ballard / Fremont
noobs can benefit from climbing a really steep hill here and there even if it isn't the best route. Hills build muscles.
joeball
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:00 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
heavy water builds more muscles
zuvembi
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:03 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 942Location: Little Addis Ababa
snyd3282 wrote:
noobs can benefit from climbing a really steep hill here and there even if it isn't the best route. Hills build muscles.
Pffft. Muscles are for body builders. Go do some intervals till you puke and then talk to me.
derrickito
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:17 am
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more bike lanes! ive seen them going up in several places. even if it's not on the most optimal route, more bike lanes is a step in the right direction.
the dreaded ben
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:26 am
Grumpy GreebJoined: 20 Aug 2005Posts: 5329Location: flavor country
derrickito wrote:
more bike lanes is a step in the right direction.
not for henry's new car.
john
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 10:27 am
AAAARRRRRGGGGbllll pppphtt!Joined: 26 Aug 2006Posts: 725Location: In the lab.
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
Helllllllll no.
I prefer James to yesler anyday.
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langston
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:30 pm
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
Eric_s wrote:
Or people might just use jackson street, it not being too far away, and a good path to use 12th to get up to seattle u.
Basically, if you're not a total meathead, there's plenty of ways to get up, over, or around that hill which don't require climbing yesler. n00b.
the only person I know who lives on first hill lives a block from Harborview. Otherwise, I usually just go straight up er.... John? The main arterial with the expressway onramp?
I don't give a fuck, that's why I ride the triple chainring.
Eric_s
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 2:46 pm
Joined: 07 Mar 2007Posts: 1691Location: the dirty south
Mr. 75 Dollars wrote:
I don't give a fuck, that's why I ride the triple chainring.
You're such a manly man!
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dennyt
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 3:28 pm
rocket mechanicJoined: 02 Aug 2005Posts: 2708
It's interesting that there is a bike lane on Dexter but not on Westlake, and now on Yesler but not Jackson.
Is SDOT trying to avoid the flat routes for bicyclists?
snyd3282
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:51 pm
could suck the fun out of a blowjobJoined: 23 Jul 2007Posts: 588Location: Ballard / Fremont
dennyt wrote:
It's interesting that there is a bike lane on Dexter but not on Westlake, and now on Yesler but not Jackson.
Is SDOT trying to avoid the flat routes for bicyclists?
Good question. I'll ask Pete Lagerway in a couple weeks at the next SBAB meeting.
john
Posted: Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:15 pm
AAAARRRRRGGGGbllll pppphtt!Joined: 26 Aug 2006Posts: 725Location: In the lab.
dennyt wrote:
It's interesting that there is a bike lane on Dexter but not on Westlake, and now on Yesler but not Jackson.
Is SDOT trying to avoid the flat routes for bicyclists?
It's interesting that there is a bike lane on Dexter but not on Westlake, and now on Yesler but not Jackson.
Is SDOT trying to avoid the flat routes for bicyclists?
Good question. I'll ask Pete Lagerway in a couple weeks at the next SBAB meeting.
Please Oh PLease let us know what Pete the SDOT apologist has to say about routing cyclists over steep fucking hills. fucker!
snyd3282
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:13 am
could suck the fun out of a blowjobJoined: 23 Jul 2007Posts: 588Location: Ballard / Fremont
coupdegrace wrote:
Please Oh PLease let us know what Pete the SDOT apologist has to say about routing cyclists over steep fucking hills. fucker!
I expect that his response will be that the BMP goal is to support many types of cyclists and that the hills are needed to support advanced cyclists, or that routing bike lanes on arterials makes them more visible to people so more people know about them and use them.
Personally, I think it was a result of a bunch of weak political compromises, that SDOT has a lot of folks who still don't get cycling.
Something tells me that they aren't selecting the routes based on current measured cyclist travel patterns, but I'd love to see the numbers if they are.
I also believe that Pete (who is just trying to make a living) got heavily bitchslapped in the last year. I heard that SDOT shifted things around a little bit and Pete had a bunch of his authority taken away from him. If we were inside SDOT and told it like it is, I expect that we would make enough career limiting moves within the first two weeks that we would be fired inside of a month. That isn't to say that a bike lane over hills in general shouldn't be fought against, but maybe he fought and lost and saying so honestly would make it hard for him to keep his job.
When I have talked to Pete before, on occasion I have seen some of those facial expressions that say "damit, I want to give you the real scoop, that was a great question, I fought and lost, but I'm going to get hurt if I tell you the truth, so here's the party line".
The trick might be to find Pete's nemesis within SDOT and apply pressure there. And no, I don't know who that is ... yet.
coupdegrace
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:51 am
Joined: 01 Nov 2006Posts: 168
snyd3282 wrote:
The trick might be to find Pete's nemesis within SDOT and apply pressure there. And no, I don't know who that is ... yet.
My suspicion is that it is Wayne Wentz.
Mind you I am not opposed to steep hills. In a few moments I'm going to ski up to the top of the Silverstar ski area again! Chairlifts are for wimps. You gotta earn your hills.
Providing climbing lanes (I hope to GOD that SDOT is not intalling a death lane on the downhill side of Yesler) on steep lesser used routes for cyclists is a disingenuous scheme to route cyclists away from more commonly used routes to keep them clear of cyclists for motorists and defensible by SDOT by claiming that it is safer. Fuck that, route the cars over the hills!
gsbarnes
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 9:57 am
Joined: 15 Aug 2006Posts: 2666Location: No Fun Town, USA
According to the BMP maps, both Yesler and Jackson are scheduled to get climbing lanes on the western slope, with bike lanes to the east.
As I understand it, they paint the lanes if they're doing something else to the street (e.g., Stone Way, which they were resurfacing before they painted the current lanes and sharrows). For other streets not scheduled for work, presumably they just do it in some random mysterious order. But remember that we passed the big Streets levy last year, and a lot of streets are scheduled for some sort of upgrade. If, for example, Jackson is to be upgraded in 2008 or 2009, my guess is they would put off any striping work until the other street work occurs.
In other words, I doubt this is a conspiracy of anything except an inscrutable SDOT paving schedule.
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coupdegrace
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:15 pm
Joined: 01 Nov 2006Posts: 168
gsbarnes wrote:
In other words, I doubt this is a conspiracy of anything except an inscrutable SDOT paving schedule.
Please explain Fairmont Ave in West Seattle. Why was it outfitted with facilities? Prior to BMP! Why does Fairmont Ave need facilites? SDOT is either clueless or conspiring to provide cyclists with difficult to use secondary routes. Are the taxes you pay secondary to your neighbor's, who chooses to drive a car?
I think that SDOT is both clueless and conspiring. Sharrows on the uphill side of Stone Way, death lanes on the downhill side?! Come on we all know the correct safe way to install these two different types of facilities (climbing lanes up hill, sharrows downhill) but SDOT can't figure it out? Which is it cluelessness or conspiracy?
Oh by the way, we had a great ski today! Apres ski time now, into the hottub I go with bourbon on the rocks in hand and Tom Waits playing smooth music on the stereo.
DJStroky
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 5:51 pm
Joined: 25 May 2007Posts: 356Location: Downtown Tacoma
gsbarnes wrote:
According to the BMP maps, both Yesler and Jackson are scheduled to get climbing lanes on the western slope, with bike lanes to the east.
As I understand it, they paint the lanes if they're doing something else to the street (e.g., Stone Way, which they were resurfacing before they painted the current lanes and sharrows). For other streets not scheduled for work, presumably they just do it in some random mysterious order. But remember that we passed the big Streets levy last year, and a lot of streets are scheduled for some sort of upgrade. If, for example, Jackson is to be upgraded in 2008 or 2009, my guess is they would put off any striping work until the other street work occurs.
In other words, I doubt this is a conspiracy of anything except an inscrutable SDOT paving schedule.
This is probably the correct answer to this dilema, but the conspiracy theory is much more exciting and believable for some reason...
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chunts
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 7:05 pm
Joined: 18 May 2007Posts: 85Location: Cappy
dennyt wrote:
It's interesting that there is a bike lane on Dexter but not on Westlake, and now on Yesler but not Jackson.
Is SDOT trying to avoid the flat routes for bicyclists?
I actually think Jackson would be a shitty place for a bike lane. there are constant buses in and out of the right lane, lights are timed well enough that cars can get up to a decent clip, and there is a lot of left-turning traffic. the concrete sections of the road surface have settled enough to create nasty ledges/bumps, not to mention concrete seams suck in general.
when I lived on beacon I rode up king street instead. the 4-way stops kinda suck, but that's about it. from the freeway to 12th there's hardly any auto traffic at all and the grade is just about exactly the same.
don't get me wrong, my argument is not that yesler is in any way a better place for a bike lane. as people have mentioned, unless you are going to harborview there's really no point in climbing that monster. going around probably takes the same amount of time.
snyd3282
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:25 pm
could suck the fun out of a blowjobJoined: 23 Jul 2007Posts: 588Location: Ballard / Fremont
Maybe the Harborview destination is the reason why they put this bike lane there. I know that SDOT has some traffic models that take into account places where people live, work, and frequently visit .. but I don't know if those were used in the BMP planning or not. Like I said, I'll ask and I'll let you know what I find out.
TrikerTrev
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 8:40 pm
Joined: 23 Oct 2006Posts: 2303Location: FOCO, MOFO!!!
call me a silly fag, but, is'nt it a TAD late to be bitchin about WHERE the bike lanes are going?
I mean, I seem to recall these discussions taking place in public meetings a year ago?
snyd3282
Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2007 10:08 pm
could suck the fun out of a blowjobJoined: 23 Jul 2007Posts: 588Location: Ballard / Fremont
TrikerTrev wrote:
call me a silly fag, but, is'nt it a TAD late to be bitchin about WHERE the bike lanes are going?
I mean, I seem to recall these discussions taking place in public meetings a year ago?
For the bike lanes on the current plan, yeah it is late. The best I hope for with the currently planned lanes (the next 5 years of work) is that steep downhills will have sharrows and up-hill grades won't have sharrows, that the sharrow placement and size will be roughly correct, and that we won't have too many people die from bad engineering.
The BMP is up for re-evaluation every 5 years, so we have 5 years to pound the message into the heads of the good folks at SDOT, and city hall about what makes a good bike lane and what makes a bad bike lane, so to some extent continuing the discussion about bike lane placement is still worthwhile in the long term. (or so I keep telling myself)
Marcus
Posted: Sat Nov 24, 2007 2:02 pm
Joined: 15 Jul 2006Posts: 173Location: Seattle
Mr. 75 Dollars wrote:
DJStroky wrote:
This grade is ridiculously steep, is anyone actually going to use this?
yes. Fear of hills is a noob thing
i work at yesler community center in the cpu lab and i'm surprised at how many people i see riding by coming from downtown. no fixies though....ever. i usually only ride up that bad boy when i'm drunk. ha.
huh, as I said, I ride that 4 times a week, on my fixie when its working.
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Alastair
Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 7:27 pm
Joined: 12 Jan 2006Posts: 475Location: U-district/Ravenna
When I have a working bike (last two weeks excluded), I ride Jackson 3 times a week to go to school. Jackson needs some serious paving work before a bike lane is even worthwhile. In either case, who needs it when Jackson was recently sharrowed!
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