this'll be my first seattle winter on a bike. i don't want to spend a ton but am willing to drop a little cash on a few items that are worth it, then round out the wardrobe with odds and ends from thrift stores.
tips? tricks? hints? suggestions? be specific. don't just say "wool", say "wool tights from smartwool that they will have to peel offa my cold, dead body- no wait- my toasty-warm, dead body because i love them so much". or something to that effect.
discuss.
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derrickito
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 3:39 pm
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
fenders. fenders fenders. fenders. full length. that'll shed lots of the water down instead of all on you from the road.
rain shell. whatever kind you want. get a good rain shell to keep your torso dry.
waterproof gloves can be nice. rei has some cheaper options with their novara brand, plus side is that you can return them easy when they die out (and they will).
layer up. wool stays warm when wet. i use smartwool base layer medium weight long sleeves and they serve great for base layers camping/hiking/biking. best 80 dollars i ever spent on a shirt: http://www.rei.com/product/785071/smartwool-midweight-long-sleeve-crew-top-wool-mens. you can also find wool options at military surplus. there are wool sweaters and pants that can be found second hand too.
for feet, if it's really pouring the waterproof/resistant shoe covers found at any bike shop can be nice. i tend to do the trick of light weight sock covered by plastic produce bag covered by knee length wool sock (smartwool!). usually keeps me pretty warm even if a bit damp
better than that, get a car hippy!
tehschkott
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 3:48 pm
daywalkerJoined: 09 Nov 2007Posts: 6108Location: Hatertown
Get a car, hippie!
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ksep
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 4:07 pm
Joined: 27 Jan 2007Posts: 1879Location: Westlake
Have you seen them new SKS Long Board fenders? The front fender looks amazing.
I second that, so soft and so perfect for anything outdoors.
also, I don't own one (yet), but I hear boot/shoe dryers are essential if you are going to try to commute every day of the week...I am a little spotty on my commuting and tend to wait until I have a dry pair of shoes or ride when rain is below 50%
lantius
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 5:27 pm
1337Joined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 6705Location: right over
ifaey wrote:
ksep wrote:
Have you seen them new SKS Long Board fenders? The front fender looks amazing.
Joined: 28 Jul 2007Posts: 1315Location: Columbia City
ifaey wrote:
tips? tricks? hints? suggestions?
discuss.
Fenders, wool socks, and a shell are adequate for most situations, but you can also be like Cliff Mass and get in the habit of watching the radar (my new favorite is www.weatherspark.com). If the sky is doing anything more than spitting, then you can time your commute (assuming some flexibility in your scheduling) to avoid the heavy stuff.
Chip McShoulder
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:03 pm
dog licking ice cream coneJoined: 11 Aug 2008Posts: 3022Location: Rainbow Road
For wool pants/sweaters on a budget, try goodwill. In the winters, I usually wear wool dress pants acquired for ~$15. That way I don't feel bad when they get all wet, dirty and worn out in the ass. If fashion is no concern at all, army/navy surplus is a good place to look also. One of my most effective sweaters is an army green job with german flags on the shoulders that I bought probably 7-8 years ago for $20.
For base layers on a budget, I like long-sleeve synthetic "workout" shirts (like Underarmor, though there are cheaper, equally effective brands). They're warm when wet, and hydrophobic like smartwool, but at a fraction of the cost ($20-25).
Lastly, keep your saddle dry when your bike is parked! I like to keep a shower cap tucked in the rails of my saddle, but a plastic bag works almost as well.
dick wang's fatherJoined: 26 Aug 2008Posts: 1707Location: devenshire
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laura
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:45 pm
Joined: 22 Jun 2007Posts: 1050Location: wherever the dance party is
This is what works for me:
- fenders: without question
- mudflaps: buy them, DIY them, whatever. DIY water bottle ones let you color coordinate!
- wool tops: I found a heavily discounted merino wool sweater at Banana Republic that carried me through fallwinterspring. I generally find smartwool and swrve wool to be too wimpy for my day-in-day-out wearings. I like Patagonia and Ibex and they are pricey, but great to put on the holiday wish list that goes to grandma. (She loves you and wants you to be warm.)
- wool socks: this is where smartwool takes the cake. CUTE STRIPED SOCKS. Internet sales on these abound on these.
- knickers that work for you: I am a 100% swrve pant junkie, mainly because I was able to try them on at Recycled. Cycles. The mens midweight is the preferred spring/fall pant and the mens winter softshell kept me toasty in the bitter cold, rainy, snow nonsense. They stretch a good deal when you wear them so I recommend buying a size that seems snug.
- raincoat: REI eVent jacket, although I can't tell which one it is. It was expensive, but a million times better than the other jackets I owned in the past so I don't consider it a waste of money. I didn't buy a cycling specific raincoat, mainly because I didn't want to wear yellow. The jacket I bought is low enough in the back for my needs, but if you have a long torso or something that may be an issue?
- boot dryer: not essential, but I love it now that I have it. It keeps your shoes from funking out overnight as they sit wet and gross. <3 When you get to work after a nice wet commute, take the footbed out of the shoe to encourage faster drying. Rogelio once mentioned that balling up newspaper and stuffing those in the shoes can help shoes dry out faster.
- gloves: a damn disaster. This remains my weakest link, but experienced some happiness with smartwool liners inside of a shell. I used the "manzella silk weight windstopper warm" as a shell and they were ok. There are good forum threads on this topic.
- smart decisions when there is black ice on the roads: a friend took a low speed spill on black ice and the helmet saved her noggin. http://www.flickr.com/photos/lgrst4/4186042531/ Pretty sure you are pro-helmet, but just in case.
Last edited by laura on Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:52 pm; edited 1 time in total _________________ alumni
joby
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 6:50 pm
goes to elevenJoined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 3899Location: The Cloud
I've found that sealskinz gauntlet gloves over thin glove liners works really well. Don't get the insulated/lined sealskinz, the insulation layer comes free and is a pain in the ass to get back in to the fingertips.
Note that this is different from the Gauntlets that Joe has.
-jason
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 7:56 pm
Command-Line KiddJoined: 17 Feb 2009Posts: 260Location: The Internet
joby wrote:
I've found that sealskinz gauntlet gloves over thin glove liners works really well. Don't get the insulated/lined sealskinz, the insulation layer comes free and is a pain in the ass to get back in to the fingertips.
Note that this is different from the Gauntlets that Joe has.
Can someone update the TOS with the circumstances for which one becomes subject to vegetablization?
Also I'm with Rob on the watching the radar to avoid the heavy stuff. My favorite (which came from a previous thread) is Seattle Rain Watch
caustic meatloaf
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:13 pm
Joined: 06 Dec 2010Posts: 1235537Location: a hammy melange...
I just double up on wool, and rely upon the water shedding nature of my underpelt to keep me dry.
But in more seriousness, I'm a HUGE fan of wool. Since I sold my car in '08, I have, with the exception of about a week or two in the summertime, ridden only in wool. The only time in the winter I don't ride in is when there's frost on the ground.
For leg layers, I'll usually wear wool tights as the underlayer, and then my green knickers over. If it's particularly nasty out, I will wear a pair of Ibex thick long pants in between. This last FHR was pretty much my heaviest layering - wool bib tights, ibex & knickers below, and then double wool layer on top. I have a wool scarf I'll tie around my neck as well.
My opinion, for especially cold days, is that you may as well take the bus. After kissing asphalt at 20mph on Boston & 19th about 3 years ago, I decided that discretion was the better part of valor. Especially after not being able to clench my teeth for 2 months, and waiting for the wool embedded in my chin to work its way out after another couple months after that. put a 3 inch divot in my helmet, and I'm still not sure how I didn't break my nose.
might have vagina, unconfirmedJoined: 06 Jan 2010Posts: 948Location: Space pirate ship manned by dinosaurs
I recommend one of these getups:
Ok but seriously, these are things I am a fan of:
Outlier lady pants, they fit nice and dry fast but aren't warm. Nice for warmer rains.
Leg warmers (sparkly ones are ++, wool is good too)
Arm warmers (easy to adjust layering)
As for rain jackets, I think pit zips are an absolute must for temperature/internal humidity control.
Toe covers for your shoes. I have eternally cold feet and these really help.
caustic meatloaf
Posted: Tue Sep 13, 2011 8:18 pm
Joined: 06 Dec 2010Posts: 1235537Location: a hammy melange...
joby wrote:
I've found that sealskinz gauntlet gloves over thin glove liners works really well. Don't get the insulated/lined sealskinz, the insulation layer comes free and is a pain in the ass to get back in to the fingertips.
Note that this is different from the Gauntlets that Joe has.
I will state for the record that the gauntlets do not appear to be winterized.
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blasdelf
Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 1:40 am
BAD NAVIGATORJoined: 01 Mar 2010Posts: 1505
Laura's got it right on the REI eVent jackets. They're actually cheaper than any of the other manufacturers using the fabric (especially the bike version) and better tailored too (though the men's ain't gonna have boobroom).
The shit breathes really really well — none of the jackets have pit zips because they don't fucking need them, pretty much the accomplishment of the century when it comes to technical outerwear.
I've got two pairs of their men's pants since they come in my rare 28x34 size and perfectly tailored. One is superlight 'summer' softshell and the other is cordura canvas. They're ridiculously expensive but totally worth it. They dry really quickly and don't stink. You can sit down at work with wet thighs and be dry in 30 minutes — hell they dry in the spin cycle of the washing machine!
ifaey
Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 9:51 pm
Joined: 10 Jun 2011Posts: 335Location: seattle
you guys are fucking awesome, thank you so much. this is EXACTLY the kind of info i need.
once again, i heart .83.
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limpyweta
Posted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 10:39 pm
Joined: 23 Sep 2008Posts: 740Location: North Beach
There are a few other threads on/related to this too, here and all over.
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joeball
Posted: Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:00 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
laura wrote:
- wool socks: this is where smartwool takes the cake. CUTE STRIPED SOCKS. Internet sales on these abound on these.
Joined: 14 Mar 2011Posts: 982Location: Wherever you go, there you are
I would like to recommend the use of a zip-lock bag. You can get wet and be fine. Your wet clothes will dry. When your phone get wet though, it might be toast.
Maybe you have a waterproof bag of some sort, which will function just as well.
When it rains though, that only thing I really need is that zip-lock.
Also, get the thick kind and you can reuse them. The cheap sandwich bag ones only work for one or two trips if you are lucky.
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soyoung
Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 5:26 pm
Joined: 14 Jul 2010Posts: 185Location: Seattle
blasdelf wrote:
The shit breathes really really well — none of the jackets have pit zips because they don't fucking need them, pretty much the accomplishment of the century when it comes to technical outerwear.
Question about these. Do they breathe when wet? Gore-tex and most other breathe-able outerlayer materials don't, and I'd much rather have pit vents without breathe-ability than vice versa.
Eric_s
Posted: Sat Sep 17, 2011 5:28 pm
Joined: 07 Mar 2007Posts: 1691Location: the dirty south
soyoung wrote:
blasdelf wrote:
The shit breathes really really well — none of the jackets have pit zips because they don't fucking need them, pretty much the accomplishment of the century when it comes to technical outerwear.
Question about these. Do they breathe when wet? Gore-tex and most other breathe-able outerlayer materials don't, and I'd much rather have pit vents without breathe-ability than vice versa.
I have the showers pass event jacket which is a little baggy... It has pit zips, and I find myself using them nearly all the time. event is really breathable, but it's just a waterproof breathable membrane just like all the others.pit zips are nice, and I've turned my jacket into a sauna by leaving them up.
mailemae
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 12:05 pm
not very stokedJoined: 03 Sep 2009Posts: 303Location: winterfell
Thanks y'alls! This is really helpful, even as I enter my third winter of riding in Seattle. My favorite red raincoat just gave up the ghost (RIP red raincoat, you served me well) so I am in in the market for a new one.
I am prone to impracticalities on my bike and in life in general, so feel free to disregard the following, but I actually love riding around in my wellies on super rainy days. They are totally water-tight and have the added bonus of keeping your trousers out of your chain, and chain grease off your trousers.
I am not aware of clipless wellies but someone should definitely invent those.
Helpful illustration:
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Jessica
Posted: Mon Sep 19, 2011 10:23 pm
Joined: 18 Sep 2007Posts: 309Location: Capitol Hill
+1 for pit zips, arm warmers and mudflaps
- glasses with clear lenses are helpful for keeping rain out of the eyes
- I love my white on black adidas superstars + platform pedals for wet/cold weather riding. The rubber shell toe and thick leather keep my feet warmish and dryish. The black color hides grime.
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ksep
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 1:05 am
Joined: 27 Jan 2007Posts: 1879Location: Westlake
Dravis Bixel wrote:
I would like to recommend the use of a zip-lock bag.
Tacky. No, you. I have no fashion sense yet even I think that's a terrible idea. Get a pair of damn shoe covers!
And I know there's a half-price less expensive version of this which I can't find right now, but full length pit-zips, son! "Hem to bicep," they say. Plenty of ventilation if you just have the tops of your arms and front/back covered with a thin secure area at the waist/hem.
_________________ -Kevin
Eric the Red
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 11:26 am
Joined: 02 May 2010Posts: 150Location: In the saddle
+1 for fenders and wool
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saccade
Posted: Tue Sep 20, 2011 1:31 pm
Joined: 19 May 2009Posts: 323Location: monkey lab
Quote:
- glasses with clear lenses are helpful for keeping rain out of the eyes
recommend solutions for keeping glasses from fogging up whenever stopped?
now with 50 percent more EVILJoined: 22 Jul 2005Posts: 10566
saccade wrote:
Quote:
- glasses with clear lenses are helpful for keeping rain out of the eyes
recommend solutions for keeping glasses from fogging up whenever stopped?
i wear glasses from the moment i wake up until i fall asleep, so i've dealt with this a bunch snowboarding, biking, hiking, whatever.
get some quality anti fogger. Cat Crap is some good stuff, it's a cream that you wipe onto your lenses. I use it in combination with a spray anti fog and usually don't have too many problems with fogging.
Joined: 25 Jul 2005Posts: 5547Location: Columbia City
saccade wrote:
Quote:
- glasses with clear lenses are helpful for keeping rain out of the eyes
recommend solutions for keeping glasses from fogging up whenever stopped?
Also a lifer glasses wearer, since 4th grade.
I've found by managing my heat retention & generation so that I'm not trapping heat when unneccessary, the glasses fogging is only an issue when going indoors. For example, instead of a heavier coat I'll wear wool layers and a rain repellent top layer with pit zips. As I know I'm coming closer to my destination, I unzip stuff, try to slow my heartrate etc so that I'm not super steamy upon stopping.
going indoors, dealing with snow cold, etc I'd listen to Derrick (!) about lens treatments. When I was a swimmer, we treated our lens as he describes.
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Razi
Posted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 6:53 pm
Joined: 16 Dec 2005Posts: 866Location: Seattle
Baby shampoo works as an anti-fogger too in a pinch, but does not last as long as the nicer stuff. To apply it, just get a dab on your fingertips and gently coat your lenses. Rinse quickly. There will not be any visible residue but it will work. This is, incidentally, also the BEST way to keep a snorkeling/scuba mask from fogging.
The group has this issue pretty well surrounded.
A few thoughts:
"waterproof" and "breathable" really tends to be neither. Not long term anyways. But a rainshell is still a valuable thing to have if you are not prone to sweating as much as I am. Still, better to be warm than to be dry so focus on keeping warm, even when wet.
Costco has started rebranding smartwool and selling them for way less than you would otherwise pay.
Wigwam socks have been more durable than smartwool for me. Maybe not for anyone else.
Icebreaker stuff, while expensive is fucking AMAZING. To test their original line of thermal baselayers they equipped the late Sir Peter Blake's expeditionary crew (round the world sailors). At the end of almost 4 months of nonstop sailing (and no showers) the crew approved the gear. It is amazing. I have smartwool stuff too, but nothing has beaten icebreaker for me.
Army wool is excellent quality. I bought a "wooly pully" pullover style 100% wool sweater with cotton elbow and shoulder patches and that thing has worn like iron. Best 60 bucks ever for a really warm sweater. Sizes run large. The store on 1st and Bell keeps tons of these things in stock. The store on 1st avenue south and Lander has a great selection of gloves, balaclavas etc.
Foot covers! I got a pair Pearl Izumi ones from the REI gear garage in 2005 and they have needed a repair here and there but have essentially lasted since then. Huge difference. The sealskinz suggestion is also golden. Foot covers will need to do a lot less work if you fender as low as possible so make it easy on yourself.
A BMX style helmet will go great lengths towards keeping your noggin warm during the cold and rainy months of the year.
Spring for an insulated water bottle or some sort of thermos to chuck in your bag. Having warm liquid ready to go on either side of your commute makes huge psychological difference. Especially for really cold mornings.
I use this radar read for precip and I really like it. The more you practice the better you will get at timing the bands of rain that pass through.
that first rainy day was my initial foray into rain riding.
it was damp. pretty much what i expected. i also found out that my bike shoes are not, in fact, the slightest bit water-resistant.
i will be compiling all the information so generously given and doing some shopping in the next few weeks.
thanks again, guys.
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tehschkott
Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 3:24 pm
daywalkerJoined: 09 Nov 2007Posts: 6108Location: Hatertown
This is what I use... when I'm not using my car.
I use a Gore-Tex hardshell with pit zips when I'm riding or moving . It's light and very warm as long as you're moving. I use the pit zips to ventilate. It's a good windbreaker and it's waterproof.
Similar jackets made with eVent fabric (instead of Gore-Tex) don't generally come with pit zips because they claim they breathe so well that they don't need them. This is true, but comes with a tradeoff. I've found the eVent fabric breathes too much for my tastes - it ventilates whether you want it to or not. This characteristic makes them a poor windbreaker which means it's hard to stay warm on a bike with it - that cold winter wind/rain/cold tears right through it while you're riding. I'm sure it's great for sitting around the camp fire or hiking or whatever - but we're exposed to the elements at 15~20mph routinely, sometimes working, sometimes coasting. The windbreaker element of it for us "ain't no joke", especially through the winter months where the wind or rain can get gnarly.
I have been cold riding on a bike in an eVent jacket, and I don't really get cold. I've never had that problem in a Gore-Tex.
When you're not moving a hardshell isn't very warm, but it's still waterproof. I usually carry a softshell something (wool shirt or other jacket) that will keep me warm when I'm not moving, and use my Gor-Tex as my winter rain shell at that point. I usually can't ride in a softshell; I start sweating like crazy if I try to.
Other than that - what others have said. Smart wool is great. Wool socks are a godsend - they're all I wear year round.
Wool arm warmers are awesome because you can sort of dial up/back your coverage whilst riding - you don't have to completely disrobe - you can just roll them up or down as you get hot or cold.
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Razi
Posted: Thu Sep 29, 2011 5:05 pm
Joined: 16 Dec 2005Posts: 866Location: Seattle
I've never ridden with eVent anything so I'm not sure how well they work.
I will say that an underrated feature of hardshells for cycling is double-ended zipper action. Depending on how aggressive your ride position is, your shoulders will be much more exposed than lower down on your torso. Pit zips are great, but the ability to unzip from the bottom while keeping the top part of the zipper zipped is super nice. You will get much better ventilation and if the rain is mild (and if you are using panniers instead of a messenger bag or backpack) your back will probably be drier from the airflow around your torso that would otherwise be stifled with a one-way zip.
My marmot precip jacket does not have this feature but I wish it did. I once borrowed a jacket that did have this feature. I think it was a mountain hardwear but I would not swear by this.
I rode all of last winter with an eVent jacket. I also have a lot of experience with Gore-Tex.
I find eVent to still be a great windbreaker, but it does breath really well and doesn't need the pit zips. It breathes better without them than my Gore-Tex stuff does with.
The REI eVent bike jacket (it is bright orange and easy to find in the store due to that) is cheaper than anything else and was on sale for 25% off around this time last year. It's the first rain jacket that I've worn and liked on my bike in the last 5 years, mostly I've been doing the "warm but wet" route of wearing many layers of wool, with the outer layer being pretty stout.
Andrew_Squirrel
Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 9:29 am
Joined: 01 Mar 2010Posts: 2098Location: Greenwood
A little bird told me the Fall REI sale starts on Oct 7th
joeball
Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 9:47 am
Joined: 24 Jul 2005Posts: 6037Location: Ether
Andrew_Squirrel wrote:
A little bird told me the Fall REI sale starts on Oct 7th
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